AKA "organ donor"?

[Andre Jute]

I was in my nearest city, Cork, today. I couldn't help noticing that
all the cycle lanes lead to, and stop at, hospitals with big accident
and emergency departments. That reminded me of the transplant surgeon
I knew who, every time he saw someone on a motorcycle or a motorized
scooter, would say, "There goes a biker, also known as an organ
donor." Cycle lanes leading straight to the A&E does look like a self-
delivery system of donors. -- AJ

[d***@boomerbicycle.ca]

Post by Andre Jute
I was in my nearest city, Cork, today. I couldn't help noticing that
all the cycle lanes lead to, and stop at, hospitals with big accident
and emergency departments. That reminded me of the transplant surgeon
I knew who, every time he saw someone on a motorcycle or a motorized
scooter, would say,  "There goes a biker, also known as an organ
donor." Cycle lanes leading straight to the A&E does look like a self-
delivery system of donors. -- AJ

My step daughter and her husband are both paramedics in Toronto. They
also call motorcyclists organ donors.

[Frank Krygowski]

 My step daughter and her husband are both paramedics in Toronto. They
also call motorcyclists organ donors.

What do they call overweight couch potatoes?

According to a friend who worked for Life Bank, couch potatoes (=
strokes) and motorists are actually the major sources of organs.

- Frank Krygowski

[Tom Sherman]

Post by Frank Krygowski

Post by d***@boomerbicycle.ca
My step daughter and her husband are both paramedics in Toronto. They
also call motorcyclists organ donors.

What do they call overweight couch potatoes?
According to a friend who worked for Life Bank, couch potatoes (=
strokes) and motorists are actually the major sources of organs.

Aristide Cavaillé-Coll provided us with the best organs.

[i***@example.com]

Post by Frank Krygowski

Post by d***@boomerbicycle.ca
My step daughter and her husband are both paramedics in Toronto. They
also call motorcyclists organ donors.

What do they call overweight couch potatoes?
According to a friend who worked for Life Bank, couch potatoes
(strokes) and motorists are actually the major sources of organs.

[Citation Needed]

Overweight couch potatoes tend to die at an oldish age and to require
a lot of expensive medical care before dying. Motorcyclists tend to
die young from head trauma, leaving a really good set of organs to
harvest and saving us all a bunch of money that would have been spent
on their cancer / heart disease had they lived to become old.

Bicyclist are a combination; likely to live longer and be more
healthy if the cars don't get them, likeley to die yound and leave
a good set of organs if the cars do get them.

Did your buddy at Life Bank just count total numbers, or did
he account for there being far fewer people and even fewer
miles travelled on two wheels?

[John Forrest Tomlinson]

Post by i***@example.com
Motorcyclists tend to
die young from head trauma

I assume you mean that people who die while motorcycling tend to die
young, not that people who ride motorcycles at all tend to die young.

Right?

[i***@example.com]

Post by John Forrest Tomlinson

Post by i***@example.com
Motorcyclists tend to
die young from head trauma

I assume you mean that people who die while motorcycling tend to die
young, not that people who ride motorcycles at all tend to die young.

Without looking it up, IIRC, the fatality rate per mile is over 50
times higher for motorcycles compared to cars. So the answer id "both."

[Frank Krygowski]

Post by i***@example.com

Post by Frank Krygowski

Post by d***@boomerbicycle.ca
My step daughter and her husband are both paramedics in Toronto. They
also call motorcyclists organ donors.

What do they call overweight couch potatoes?
According to a friend who worked for Life Bank, couch potatoes
(strokes) and motorists are actually the major sources of organs.

[Citation Needed]
Overweight couch potatoes tend to die at an oldish age and to require
a lot of expensive medical care before dying. Motorcyclists tend to
die young from head trauma, leaving a really good set of organs to
harvest and saving us all a bunch of money that would have been spent
on their cancer / heart disease had they lived to become old.
Bicyclist are a combination; likely to live longer and be more
healthy if the cars don't get them, likeley to die yound and leave
a good set of organs if the cars do get them.
Did your buddy at Life Bank just count total numbers, or did
he account for there being far fewer people and even fewer
miles travelled on two wheels?

He was talking about the total numbers, which makes sense to me.
IIRC, he said stroke victims were #1, car occupants #2 sources of
donors. He's got a kidney that came from a motorist.

Most of this is just availability. In the US in a typical year, there
are about 700,000 heart disease deaths, 150,000 stroke deaths, and
40,000 motorist deaths. There are about 5000 pedestrian deaths, only
2000 motorcyclist deaths, and only about 750 bicyclist deaths. (What
do those paramedics say about pedestrians?)

He explained that motorcycle, pedestrian and bicycle fatalities have
another problem, in that the organs are likely to be damaged by
impact; and that heart deaths don't generate lots of organ donations
because the typical death cycle includes greatly reduced oxygen to the
organs, which ruins them. Stroke deaths often feature the final hours
on a respirator, which keeps the organs very healthy. And apparently
the nice padding and airbags inside a car often serve to protect the
organs.

BTW, I have had four friends who suffered strokes - two fatal - while
in their 40s or 50s. I know that one did have organs harvested.

In any case, I find cracks like "organ donor" offensive. The fact
that they're inaccurate is just icing on the cake.

- Frank Krygowski

[Carl Sundquist]

Post by Frank Krygowski

Post by i***@example.com

Post by Frank Krygowski

Post by d***@boomerbicycle.ca
My step daughter and her husband are both paramedics in Toronto. They
also call motorcyclists organ donors.

What do they call overweight couch potatoes?
According to a friend who worked for Life Bank, couch potatoes
(strokes) and motorists are actually the major sources of organs.

[Citation Needed]
Overweight couch potatoes tend to die at an oldish age and to require
a lot of expensive medical care before dying. Motorcyclists tend to
die young from head trauma, leaving a really good set of organs to
harvest and saving us all a bunch of money that would have been spent
on their cancer / heart disease had they lived to become old.
Bicyclist are a combination; likely to live longer and be more
healthy if the cars don't get them, likeley to die yound and leave
a good set of organs if the cars do get them.
Did your buddy at Life Bank just count total numbers, or did
he account for there being far fewer people and even fewer
miles travelled on two wheels?

He was talking about the total numbers, which makes sense to me.
IIRC, he said stroke victims were #1, car occupants #2 sources of
donors. He's got a kidney that came from a motorist.
Most of this is just availability. In the US in a typical year, there
are about 700,000 heart disease deaths, 150,000 stroke deaths, and
40,000 motorist deaths. There are about 5000 pedestrian deaths, only
2000 motorcyclist deaths, and only about 750 bicyclist deaths. (What
do those paramedics say about pedestrians?)

I think your numbers are low for motorcycles. Haven't checked the others.

[c***@comcast.net]

Post by Carl Sundquist

Post by Frank Krygowski

Post by i***@example.com

Post by Frank Krygowski

Post by d***@boomerbicycle.ca
My step daughter and her husband are both paramedics in Toronto. They
also call motorcyclists organ donors.

What do they call overweight couch potatoes?
According to a friend who worked for Life Bank, couch potatoes
(strokes) and motorists are actually the major sources of organs.

[Citation Needed]
Overweight couch potatoes tend to die at an oldish age and to require
a lot of expensive medical care before dying. Motorcyclists tend to
die young from head trauma, leaving a really good set of organs to
harvest and saving us all a bunch of money that would have been spent
on their cancer / heart disease had they lived to become old.
Bicyclist are a combination; likely to live longer and be more
healthy if the cars don't get them, likeley to die yound and leave
a good set of organs if the cars do get them.
Did your buddy at Life Bank just count total numbers, or did
he account for there being far fewer people and even fewer
miles travelled on two wheels?

He was talking about the total numbers, which makes sense to me.
IIRC, he said stroke victims were #1, car occupants #2 sources of
donors. He's got a kidney that came from a motorist.
Most of this is just availability. In the US in a typical year, there
are about 700,000 heart disease deaths, 150,000 stroke deaths, and
40,000 motorist deaths. There are about 5000 pedestrian deaths, only
2000 motorcyclist deaths, and only about 750 bicyclist deaths. (What
do those paramedics say about pedestrians?)

I think your numbers are low for motorcycles. Haven't checked the others.

Dear Carl,

"Nationwide, 5,037 motorcyclists died in 2007, the highest death count
in more than 30 years and accounting for about 12 percent of all motor
vehicle deaths that year . . ."
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/28493347/

Cheers,

Carl Fogel

[i***@example.com]

Post by c***@comcast.net
"Nationwide, 5,037 motorcyclists died in 2007, the highest death count
in more than 30 years and accounting for about 12 percent of all motor
vehicle deaths that year . . ."
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/28493347/

Now go outside and look at any highway. Do motorcycles make up
12% of the traffic? No. 1.2%? Still no. 0.12%? Perhaps.

[Frank Krygowski]

Post by Carl Sundquist

Post by Frank Krygowski

Post by i***@example.com

Post by Frank Krygowski

Post by d***@boomerbicycle.ca
My step daughter and her husband are both paramedics in Toronto. They
also call motorcyclists organ donors.

What do they call overweight couch potatoes?
According to a friend who worked for Life Bank, couch potatoes
(strokes) and motorists are actually the major sources of organs.

[Citation Needed]
Overweight couch potatoes tend to die at an oldish age and to require
a lot of expensive medical care before dying. Motorcyclists tend to
die young from head trauma, leaving a really good set of organs to
harvest and saving us all a bunch of money that would have been spent
on their cancer / heart disease had they lived to become old.
Bicyclist are a combination; likely to live longer and be more
healthy if the cars don't get them, likeley to die yound and leave
a good set of organs if the cars do get them.
Did your buddy at Life Bank just count total numbers, or did
he account for there being far fewer people and even fewer
miles travelled on two wheels?

He was talking about the total numbers, which makes sense to me.
IIRC, he said stroke victims were #1, car occupants #2 sources of
donors.  He's got a kidney that came from a motorist.
Most of this is just availability.  In the US in a typical year, there
are about 700,000 heart disease deaths, 150,000 stroke deaths, and
40,000 motorist deaths.  There are about 5000 pedestrian deaths, only
2000 motorcyclist deaths, and only about 750 bicyclist deaths.  (What
do those paramedics say about pedestrians?)

I think your numbers are low for motorcycles. Haven't checked the others.

You're right. I didn't do that from memory, I looked them up (well,
except for pedestrian deaths) but I don't know if my motorcycle number
was from a bad source (via Google) or a typo on my part. I'd check my
browser history, but I'm away from that computer now.

The others came from either World Almanac or NHTSA.

- Frank Krygowski

[John Forrest Tomlinson]

On Wed, 28 Jan 2009 09:27:30 -0800 (PST), Frank Krygowski

Post by Frank Krygowski
He explained that motorcycle, pedestrian and bicycle fatalities have
another problem, in that the organs are likely to be damaged by
impact; and that heart deaths don't generate lots of organ donations
because the typical death cycle includes greatly reduced oxygen to the
organs, which ruins them. Stroke deaths often feature the final hours
on a respirator, which keeps the organs very healthy. And apparently
the nice padding and airbags inside a car often serve to protect the
organs.

This ghoulish but interesting info.

[John Thompson]

Post by Frank Krygowski

 My step daughter and her husband are both paramedics in Toronto. They
also call motorcyclists organ donors.

What do they call overweight couch potatoes?

"Back injuries"

[l***@comcast.net]

Hi - I've mentioned this on different contexts in NG's before. I'm a
trauma surgeon with 26 years under my belt (counting residency and
fellowships) and have treated about 30,000 major trauma victims. While
it's true that there are 750 bicycling fatalities annually, most of
them are not what we would consider 'cyclists.' Most of the bike
fatalities and serious injuries that I've seen in people who are
intoxicated, riding in ill-advised areas, no lights at night, etc. I
won't even touch the helmet war, but you can infer what my position
is.
In all this time, I've taken care of '3' real cyclists with serious
injuries and no fatals, and I live/work in an area with plenty of
recreational cyclists and racing. Tour of Somerville 1994 a pack
crash, guy got rran over by the peleton and got a serious liver
injury. I've seen one trathlete struck by a truck, major chest injury,
recovered well and one woman recreational cyclist who crashed at the
bottom of a long descent on gravel and had a serious head injury.
Beyond that, the typical 'cyclist' and all the faytalities I've seen
are at 3 AM, UDS shows cocaine/cannabinoids/ and/or narcotics with or
without alcohol, riding without lights into traffic, etc.
True, as cyclists we generate a lot of fractures, etc., for the
orthopaedists and ED docs, but an experienced rider rarely generates
life threatening injury. On a personal level, I'm relatively risk-
averse (I have a wife, three kids, and a heavy professional societal
responsibility.) I have no qualms that I put any of it at risk by
riding and racing. The only time I ever had any doubts was during my
brief Cat V stint before being able to upgrade to Master's racing. If
all racing was that sketchy, I wouldn't have been comfortable
continuing.

YMMV. Be safe out there.

Lou D'Amelio

BTW: almost everyone in health care has referred to motorcyclists as
'organ donors' as long as I have been around. Nothing new. Nobody
thinks of cyclists in that context. In fact, we 'contribute' so little
to trauma care that most people in health care don't even identify us
as a distinct subculture.

[Frank Krygowski]

Post by l***@comcast.net
Hi - I've mentioned this on different contexts in NG's before. I'm a
trauma surgeon with 26 years under my belt (counting residency and
fellowships) and have treated about 30,000 major trauma victims. While
it's true that there are 750 bicycling fatalities annually, most of
them are not what we would consider 'cyclists.'  Most of the bike
fatalities and serious injuries that I've seen in people who are
intoxicated, riding in ill-advised areas, no lights at night, etc....
In all this time, I've taken care of '3' real cyclists with serious
injuries and no fatals, and I live/work in an area with plenty of
recreational cyclists and racing. ...
In fact, we 'contribute' so little
to trauma care that most people in health care don't even identify us
as a distinct subculture.

We've occasionally had other medical people telling the same story.
It's good to hear.

But unfortunately, there is a contingent of medical workers who
somehow get a missionary spirit for warning people about bicycling.

They should be warning about riding when intoxicated, riding without
lights, violating rules of the road, etc. Instead, they tend to cry
"Any fall off a bike could kill you..." and treat a ride around the
neighborhood as if it were equivalent to a gonzo, mass start, off-
road, downhill pack race.

How do they get that attitude?

- Frank Krygowski

[Michael Press]

In article

Post by l***@comcast.net
Hi - I've mentioned this on different contexts in NG's before. I'm a
trauma surgeon with 26 years under my belt (counting residency and
fellowships) and have treated about 30,000 major trauma victims. While
it's true that there are 750 bicycling fatalities annually, most of
them are not what we would consider 'cyclists.' Most of the bike
fatalities and serious injuries that I've seen in people who are
intoxicated, riding in ill-advised areas, no lights at night, etc. I
won't even touch the helmet war, but you can infer what my position
is.
In all this time, I've taken care of '3' real cyclists with serious
injuries and no fatals, and I live/work in an area with plenty of
recreational cyclists and racing. Tour of Somerville 1994 a pack
crash, guy got rran over by the peleton and got a serious liver
injury. I've seen one trathlete struck by a truck, major chest injury,
recovered well and one woman recreational cyclist who crashed at the
bottom of a long descent on gravel and had a serious head injury.
Beyond that, the typical 'cyclist' and all the faytalities I've seen
are at 3 AM, UDS shows cocaine/cannabinoids/ and/or narcotics with or
without alcohol, riding without lights into traffic, etc.
True, as cyclists we generate a lot of fractures, etc., for the
orthopaedists and ED docs, but an experienced rider rarely generates
life threatening injury. On a personal level, I'm relatively risk-
averse (I have a wife, three kids, and a heavy professional societal
responsibility.) I have no qualms that I put any of it at risk by
riding and racing. The only time I ever had any doubts was during my
brief Cat V stint before being able to upgrade to Master's racing. If
all racing was that sketchy, I wouldn't have been comfortable
continuing.
YMMV. Be safe out there.
Lou D'Amelio
BTW: almost everyone in health care has referred to motorcyclists as
'organ donors' as long as I have been around. Nothing new. Nobody
thinks of cyclists in that context. In fact, we 'contribute' so little
to trauma care that most people in health care don't even identify us
as a distinct subculture.

Thanks for that.

[i***@example.com]

Post by l***@comcast.net
True, as cyclists we generate a lot of fractures, etc., for the
orthopaedists and ED docs, but an experienced rider rarely generates
life threatening injury.

Makes sense, considering the speeds involved.

[Don Mackie]

Hi Lou,
I've got similar time in anaesthesia and emergency medicine at the
sharp end (I'm a pen pusher these days).
I've a very similar experience of cycling injuries to yours as well.
One thing I noted, there was a study in BMJ 10 years or more ago
looking at London, found fatalities more common when cyclists come
into conflict with buses and heavy goods vehicles. Not surprising but
is at the back of my mind on my commuting run through a truck-dense
industrial area.

As to organ donors, the real tragedy (to me) is the number of
perfectly good organs that get buried or cremated because people
haven't planned ahead or kin are squeamish about donation.